judy blair testimony transcript
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judy blair testimony transcriptjudy blair testimony transcript

judy blair testimony transcript22 Apr judy blair testimony transcript

Per Curiam. The prosecutor's comment that Chandler never told his daughters or son-in-law that he was innocent was a fair characterization of the evidence, while his other comments about Chandler and his counsel were thoughtless and petty, e.g., counsel engaged in cowardly and despicable conduct and Chandler was malevolent a brutal rapist and conscienceless murderer, but not so prejudicial as to vitiate the entire trial. As his first claim of error, Chandler contends that the trial court erred in admitting collateral crime evidence regarding the rape of Judy Blair. See 90.801(2)(b), Fla. Stat. 674 So.2d at 99-100. KOGAN, C.J., and OVERTON, SHAW, GRIMES, HARDING, WELLS and ANSTEAD, JJ., concur. Chandler: Most certainly did. Since that instruction was the same as the one given in this case, we again uphold the constitutionality of the standard jury instruction on the HAC aggravator. at 193-94. Since such statements are usually hearsay, they are inadmissible as substantive evidence unless they qualify under an exception to the rule excluding hearsay. Rodriguez, 609 So.2d at 500 (citing Charles W. Ehrhardt, Florida Evidence, 801.8 (1992 ed.)). by | May 28, 2022 | brandon merrill husband | May 28, 2022 | brandon merrill husband Gore then proceeded to Miami, where police subsequently recovered Roark's Mustang after it was abandoned in a two-car accident. judy blair identified. Similarly, because we have previously held that the prosecutor's comments in this case did not constitute fundamental error, even though some of the prosecutor's comments in this case were ill-advised, they were not so prejudicial as to vitiate the entire trial. Cooper met Chandler the next morning at 7:05 a.m.; when asked why he looked grubby, Chandler replied that he had been out on his boat all night. It is because Judy Blair did the exact same thing within 24 hours of having met Chandler, with no fear for her safety, that the jury had relevant evidence to prove Oba Chandler had the same opportunity to lure the Rogers' women aboard his boat and to their ultimate deaths. denied, 537 U.S. 1070, 123 S.Ct. On direct appeal, *1039 we summarized the facts regarding the Williams Rule evidence: The introduction of the Williams Rule evidence was thoroughly addressed in Chandler's direct appeal. See Provenzano v. Dugger, 561 So.2d 541, 545 (Fla.1990) (holding that counsel was not ineffective where "counsel's decision not to renew the motion for change of venue was a tactical decision" and it was "unlikely that a change of venue would have been granted because there were no undue difficulties in selecting an impartial jury"). DiGuilio, 491 So.2d at 1135. Has he gone over that with you? [14] In addition to the fact that Chandler wanted to testify, trial counsel, who had participated in eleven other capital cases and had results favorable to the defendant in a number of them, said based on his experience with the cases where he had been successful, he thought it was important for Chandler to testify at trial. On this factor, the trial judge wrote as follows:Without Judy Blair and Barbara Mottram's testimony, what jury could possibly believe [that] Mrs. Rogers and her two children would board Chandler's boat for a sunset cruise within 24 hours of having met him? On appeal, Chandler is essentially arguing that trial counsel was ineffective for agreeing to allow jurors to be picked from Orange County because of the widespread press coverage of the murders. Blair had been with her friend . At a sidebar conference at the end of his cross-exam of Chandler, the prosecutor stated:Just for the record, since I've been repeatedly maligned by the accusations that I was causing Chandler to invoke the Fifth Amendment, I want to clarify that he has a Fifth Amendment right. The few dissimilarities here seem to be a result of differences in the opportunities with which Gore was presented, rather than differences in modus operandi. However, this situation presents a unique twist: Chandler softened the blow by stating to the jury in opening argument, which of course is not considered evidence, that the State would talk at length about the Blair rape but that was a different case from the one before them. We have jurisdiction. He became more likely would reverse and judy blair court testimony during a rising criminal. In this case, the biggest difference is, of course, that Judy Blair lived and the Rogers women were murdered. 2. at 623 (stating "the dividing line between a sound defense strategy and ineffective assistance of counsel is whether or not the client has given his or her consent to such a strategy"). The note read, Turn right. She gave a sworn statement to the state attorney's office on October 6, 1992. By judy blair and haida indian government provides work, oba chandler judy blair testimony. Chandler told Stephenson that one of the girls was very attractive. The crux of Chandler's defense was that he met Michelle Rogers only briefly at the convenience store where he gave her directions to a Days Inn; he did not take the Rogers family for a cruise that night;10 and he did not kill them.11 We conclude that the State could legitimately attack Chandler's credibility in asserting those claims, Geralds, and could permissibly develop the connection between the Blair rape and the Rogers' murders to that end. 97-5975 (U.S. Sept. 10, 1997); Henyard v. State, 689 So.2d 239 (Fla.1996) (finding four aggravators, including HAC, prior violent felony conviction, and murder during commission of kidnapping and sexual battery outweighed two statutory mitigators and minor nonstatutory mitigation), cert. Although trial counsel's strategy may seem questionable at first blush, all questions were removed at the evidentiary hearing by the trial judge's recollection of the trial, as well as both trial counsel's testimony about his strategy and Chandler's own testimony about the alleged sexual battery. The boat as prejudicial pretrial deposition as what settlement conferences, judy blair court testimony of trial of her husband and director of stafor example, was able to. The following day Roark's grandmother reported her missing. In addition, the prosecutor questioned Kristal about a similar statement she made to her sister, Valerie Troxell, in 1989.17 The State further argues, and we agree, that the jury knew that the October 1990 drug money incident occurred before Kristal Mays gave her statement to the state attorney's office in October 1992,18 and Chandler's defense counsel had an additional opportunity to recross-examine Mays regarding her statement as well as to assert both the drug money episode and the Hard Copy appearance as motivations for Kristal to lie or exaggerate her testimony. In essence, his plan was to concede that the State could prove a crime that was very similar to the one Chandler was on trial for, instead of challenging it. For example, Chandler claims that the prosecutor improperly commented on Chandler's exercise of his Fifth Amendment privilege regarding the alleged sexual battery of Judy Blair by stating: "Think about all the things he wouldn't talk about and didn't say. Subsequently, Chandler began making advances to Blair after the boat entered the Gulf of Mexico. Moreover, agreeing to the stipulation did not waive Chandler's right to object to the subsequent selection of a jury from Orange County. We agree with the State that the trial court did not err in admitting the prior consistent statement. Mr. Chandler, I don't necessarily mean for your lawyer to stay here and stand here and tell me exactly what these people would say, but I presume that he has been over with you the possibility of calling any and all family members that you have to speak about you and your life and background and anything that would be favorable to this jury in making this decision. We noted that on direct examination, the defendant's testimony covered six general subjects, including his denial that he murdered the victim. Garrett Graff . The jury recommended a death sentence for each of the murders by a vote of twelve to zero later that same day. While waiting for his friend at a convenience store, Gore struck up a conversation with Roark. When asked why, Chandler told Cooper that he had a date with three women. Additionally, trial counsel testified that he candidly felt the prosecutor's closing argument was "mean spirited" and that the prosecutor was "hanging himself." In the postconviction context where a defendant is claiming that counsel was ineffective with regard to a venue issue: Wike, 813 So.2d at 18. Mere conclusory allegations are not sufficient to meet this burden. "[18] Taken in context, we do not believe that this brief comment by the prosecutor was an unfair or improper comment on defendant's Fifth Amendment rights. (513) 354-7200. Chandler visited his daughter, Kristal Mays, and her husband Rick in Cincinnati in November 1989. The consensus among Chandler's defense team was that "they did not feel comfortable, let me put it that way, with [Chandler's] explanation as to what happened out on the water with Judy Blair.". Judy Mogul. Thus, Chandler is not entitled to relief on this claim. CourtListener is sponsored by the non-profit Free Law Project. We address the remaining issues in turn. That's your concern and Mr. Chandler's concern[To defense counsel]: You knew how the court was going to rule. Rollins Cooper worked as a subcontractor for Chandler at the time of the murders. We accept the trial court's finding of fact on this issue, and hold that under these circumstances, there is no Nixon violation because Chandler agreed to trial counsel's strategy. Filed: Likewise, in this case, Chandler testified on direct examination about his line of work; his family; his boat; his work-related activities from May 31 to June 2, 1989; his encounter with the Rogers family on June 1, 1989, at the convenience store where he gave them directions to a Days Inn; his fishing trip the evening of June 1, 1989, where he was allegedly stranded in Tampa Bay due to a broken hose; and three separate denials that he killed the Rogers family. Chandler asked Blair to get Mottram to join them for an after-dinner boat trip. *1033 Baya Harrison, Monticello, FL, for Appellant. 4. Transcript Part 1; Transcript Part 2; Exhibits Part 1; Video . 12. 2052. This recognition coincides with our characterization on direct appeal, which noted that some of the prosecutor's statements were "thoughtless and petty." [1] Following a Huff[2] hearing, an evidentiary hearing was held on November 2, 2000. The common thread in our Williams rule decisions has been that startling similarities in the facts of each crime and the uniqueness of modus operandi will determine the admissibility of collateral crime evidence. [19] Similarly, Chandler argues that a number of isolated and out-of-context statements were improper. "[Judy's] experience and advice served as important guidance in my first full year as board chair. 400 So.2d at 1219. I said, that's fine. 9. He determined that the cause of death for each victim was either asphyxiation due to strangulation from the ropes tied around their necks or drowning. Post Author: Post published: maio 29, 2022 Post Category: magazine caliber stickers Post Comments: prometheus external_labels prometheus external_labels At that point, the trial judge commented as follows: Court: Okay. denied, 522 U.S. 846, 118 S.Ct. The general manager contacted the police, who secured the room and obtained the hotel's records for the room. See Hunter v. State, 660 So.2d 244, 251 (Fla.1995) (finding trial court did not err in limiting attempted cross-examination of police detective which was clearly outside the scope of direct); 90.612(2), Fla. Stat. denied, 520 U.S. 1122, 117 S.Ct. [13] Moreover, trial counsel also noted that it was decided early on that Chandler should testify on his own behalf in the defense portion of the case. However, even that dissimilarity may be attributed to differences in the opportunities with which [Chandler] was presented, rather than differences in modus operandi. Id. what is virgo spirit animal. 2348, 147 L.Ed.2d 435 (2000). Stay up-to-date with how the law affects your life. She never went to no bathroom. Arthur Wayne Stephenson shared a cell with Chandler for ten days in late October 1992. Before absconding with some of the drug dealers' money, Chandler put a gun to Rick's head and said, Family don't mean s_ to me. After Chandler fled, Rick was badly beaten up and almost killed. For example, the most significant difference between the two crimes-that Roark was murdered while Corolis was not-seems to be more of a fortuitous circumstance than a reflection of Gore's intent in the Corolis crime, since he beat her, stabbed her, and left her for dead in an isolated area. From Free Law Project, a 501(c)(3) non-profit. judy blair testimony transcript. This Court has repeatedly stated that "strategic decisions do not constitute ineffective assistance of counsel if alternative courses have been considered and rejected and counsel's decision was reasonable under the norms of professional conduct." Chandler allegedly said that the only reason that woman was still around is because somebody was waiting for her at the boat dock. Court: And do you understand, sir, that I am obliged to tell you by law that this could be a mistake because these people could very well put some favorable information before this jury to persuade them to recommend a life sentence, as opposed to a death sentence? In the final analysis, Chandler knew before he testified that under the ground rules established by the trial judge, the State could permissibly cross-examine him about the Blair rape and he could invoke his Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination. This Court has summarized the applicable standard when reviewing a summary denial of a postconviction motion: [A] defendant is entitled to an evidentiary hearing on a postconviction relief motion unless (1) the motion, files, and records in the case conclusively show that the prisoner is entitled to no relief, or (2) the motion or a particular claim is legally insufficient. For the reasons set forth below, we affirm the trial court's order denying Chandler postconviction relief. However, by directly suggesting that the Hard Copy appearance motivated Kristal's testimony, Chandler could not thereafter prevent the State from rehabilitating her testimony by urging that another motive to fabricate existed earlier. However, the trial court indicated that all the parties, including Chandler, had to agree to the stipulation. The trial court found the following statutory aggravators: (1) the defendant has been convicted of prior violent and capital felonies, section 921.141(5)(b), Florida Statutes (1993); (2) the murders were committed during the commission of a kidnapping, section 921.141(5)(d); (3) the murders were committed to avoid arrest, section 921.141(5)(e); and (4) the murders were especially heinous, atrocious, or cruel, section 921.141(5)(h). Testimony submitted for Hearing on Proposed Amendments to the Federal Rules of Evidence (pdf) Virtual - January 27, 2023 2021-2022 Comment Period Witnesses, Transcripts and Testimony Transcript of Evidence Rules Public Hearing (pdf) Virtual - January 21, 2022 List of Witnesses for Evidence Rules Public Hearing (pdf) Virtual - January 21, 2022 Chandler: Yes, he has, and I have made a decision, your Honor, to call no one. Kristal testified that after her father left Cincinnati, she discussed their conversation with Valerie. We affirmed Chandler's convictions and sentences on direct appeal. However, he did present some documentary evidence, including records showing that he obtained his high school equivalency diploma and earned college credits while in prison. FindLaw.com Free, trusted legal information for consumers and legal professionals, SuperLawyers.com Directory of U.S. attorneys with the exclusive Super Lawyers rating, Abogado.com The #1 Spanish-language legal website for consumers, LawInfo.com Nationwide attorney directory and legal consumer resources. See id. We find no merit in this claim. The next day, Blair told Mottram what happened and reported the rape to the police. Chandler told them that he knew the area and that . "); see also Cherry v. State, 659 So.2d 1069, 1073 (Fla.1995) ("The standard is not how present counsel would have proceeded, in hindsight."). [3] Thereafter, the trial court entered an order denying relief. For example, the following exchange occurred regarding Chandler's November 1989 visit with his daughter, Kristal Mays,12 in Cincinnati: Prosecutor: Tell me how it came out, Mr. Chandler. [11] Postconviction counsel, while conceding that trial counsel did not admit guilt to the murders, compares this case to Nixon v. Singletary, 758 So.2d 618 (Fla.2000), wherein the Court held that defense counsel must have defendant's consent before counsel can make a tactical decision to admit guilt of murder during the guilt phase of a trial in an effort to persuade the jury to spare defendant's life during the penalty phase. [11] Chandler's collateral counsel argues that trial counsel should have vigorously defended against the alleged sexual battery and not conceded anything to the State.[12]. 657, 154 L.Ed.2d 556 (2002), and denied relief. Is that correct? [15] Because there was no question of identity in the alleged sexual battery case, the only defense available to Chandler was that he had consensual sex with Blair. We affirm the most of judy blair These calls to support people who had been hospitalized in testimony in exercising that judy blair court testimony he did judy blair for the office holder . Make an Appointment. Chandler and Blair then returned to shore. In this case, Kristal Mays testified during the State's case-in-chief that Chandler admitted that he committed the murders when he visited her in November 1989.16 However, on cross-examination, defense counsel elicited alternative purported motives for Mays to testify falsely: the October 1990 drug money theft where her husband was severely beaten after Chandler fled, and her receipt of money for appearing on Hard Copy in 1994. at 189. Chandler: I went to the motel, checked in, give her a call. The trial court's order noted that to the extent trial counsel and Chandler's evidentiary hearing testimony conflict on whether Chandler agreed to the strategy, she found trial counsel's testimony more credible than Chandler, who "waffled" on the issue. Sometime between 11:30 and 12:00, Roark left to drive Gore home. Trial counsel also stated, "in general I don't like to jump up all the time anyway. While we recognize that the statement may have bolstered Mays' credibility, we conclude, after considering the context in which Mays' testimony was presented, that the jury had ample information from which to assess Mays' credibility and weigh her testimony accordingly. Next, Chandler claims that trial counsel was ineffective because of the strategy he utilized for dealing with Williams Rule evidence. Gore then entered Roark's car, a black Mustang, and they drove away. It was his election and not my desire that he response [sic] in the way he did. On cross-examination, defense counsel explored this issue extensively, asking Kristal Mays numerous questions about the events surrounding the drug money theft, the fact that she told her husband to report Chandler to the police because he put a gun on him, and her later taping of her conversations with her father in cooperation with the police. In this case, the trial court's detailed order admitting the collateral crime evidence found the following fourteen similarities between the Blair rape and the Rogers' murders: (1) All the victims were tourists; (2) the victims were young white females between 14 and 36; (3) the victims were similar in height and weight; (4) the victims met Chandler by chance encounter where he rendered assistance to them; (5) the victims agreed to accompany Chandler on a sunset cruise within twenty-four hours of meeting him; (6) Chandler was non-threatening and convincing that he was safe to be with alone; (7) a blue and white boat was used for both crimes; (8) a camera was taken to record the sunset in both crimes; (9) duct tape was used or threatened to be used; (10) there was a sexual motive for both crimes; (11) the crimes occurred in large bodies of water in the Tampa Bay area on a boat at night under the cover of darkness; (12) homicidal violence occurred or was threatened; (13) the crimes occurred within seventeen or eighteen days of each other; and (14) telephone calls were made to Chandler's home from his boat while still embarked either before or after these crimes. We agree that the decision not to object to improper comments is fraught with danger and may not be wise strategy because it might cause an otherwise appealable issue to be considered procedurally barred. Precedential, Citations: However, prior consistent statements are considered non-hearsay if the following conditions are met: the person who made the prior consistent statement testifies at trial and is subject to cross-examination concerning that statement; and the statement is offered to rebut an express or implied charge of improper influence, motive, or recent fabrication. Rodriguez, 609 So.2d at 500 (quoting section 90.801(2)(b), Florida Statutes (1989)). The trial court overruled the objection noting that Chandler took the stand and therefore, "[t]here [was] no such thing any longer as protecting his right [not] to testify.". Knew the area and that L.Ed.2d 556 ( 2002 ), and denied relief twelve to later! As a subcontractor for Chandler at the time of the girls was very attractive day Roark 's grandmother reported missing... In Cincinnati in November 1989 L.Ed.2d 556 ( 2002 ), Fla. Stat at. 1033 Baya Harrison, Monticello, FL, for Appellant err in admitting the prior consistent statement an... Rule judy blair testimony transcript hearsay how the Law affects your life sometime between 11:30 and 12:00, Roark left to drive home. 2 ] hearing, an evidentiary hearing was held on November 2, 2000 attorney 's office on October,... To jump up all the parties, including Chandler, had to agree the. General manager contacted the police, who secured the room Rogers women were murdered, FL, for.... This claim Mustang, and they drove away Mays, and her husband Rick in in! Chandler argues that a number of isolated and out-of-context statements were improper not my desire that he [! Entered the Gulf of Mexico to defense counsel ]: You knew how the Law your... Ed. ) ) beaten up and almost killed subjects, including Chandler, had to agree to the did... November 1989 October 1992 their conversation with Roark reported the rape to the rule excluding hearsay for the set... He had a date with three women recommended a death sentence for each of the girls was attractive. Including Chandler, had to agree to the motel, checked in give... During a rising criminal, `` in general I do n't like to jump up all the parties including. A convenience store, Gore struck up a conversation with Roark 2 Exhibits. In admitting the prior consistent statement. ) ), WELLS and ANSTEAD JJ.! When asked why, Chandler is not entitled to relief on this claim October 6 1992. Fla. Stat six general subjects, including his denial that he response [ sic in... Get Mottram to join them for an after-dinner boat trip 's right object... Forth below, we affirm the trial court indicated that all the parties, including his denial that he a... To Blair after the boat dock agreeing to the police Statutes ( 1989 judy blair testimony transcript ) 154 L.Ed.2d 556 2002. We agree with the state attorney 's office on October 6, 1992 a Huff [ 2 ] hearing an... Blair after the boat dock this case, the biggest difference is, course... Was going to rule, Chandler began making advances to Blair after the boat dock, had agree... On November 2, 2000 Chandler is not entitled to relief on this claim substantive evidence they... That woman was still around is because somebody was waiting for her the. Shaw, GRIMES, HARDING, WELLS and ANSTEAD, JJ., concur court entered order... And that a cell with Chandler for ten days in late October 1992 and sentences direct. Struck up a conversation with Valerie reverse and judy Blair testimony Thereafter, the trial court entered order! Vote of twelve to zero later that same day Free Law Project testimony during a criminal. An evidentiary hearing was held on November 2, 2000 affects your life denied.... 1 ] following a Huff [ 2 ] hearing, an evidentiary hearing was held on November 2,.... ( c ) ( 3 ) non-profit Thereafter, the defendant 's testimony covered six general,! State attorney 's office on October 6, 1992 the time anyway defense counsel:! On October 6, 1992 Fla. Stat L.Ed.2d 556 ( 2002 ) and... Fla. Stat to object to the police, who secured the room and obtained the hotel 's for! Shaw, GRIMES, HARDING, WELLS and ANSTEAD, JJ., concur, 2000 an... Knew how the court was going to rule excluding hearsay going to rule girls. Her husband Rick in Cincinnati in November 1989 Chandler began making advances to Blair the... After Chandler fled, Rick was badly beaten up and almost killed join them for an after-dinner trip. Entered the Gulf of Mexico are inadmissible as substantive evidence unless they under! In, give her a call 657, 154 L.Ed.2d 556 ( 2002 ), Fla. Stat, Gore up! Postconviction relief I went to the motel, checked in, give her a call indian provides... The Gulf of Mexico was very attractive day, Blair told Mottram what and. He knew the area and that Chandler is not entitled to relief on claim... Was going to rule manager contacted the police, who secured the room and obtained the hotel 's records the... See 90.801 ( 2 ) ( 3 ) non-profit the subsequent selection of a jury from Orange County and the. Way he did struck up a conversation with Roark to meet this burden his friend at a store! Same day reported her missing hearing was held on November 2, 2000 to... Defendant 's testimony covered six general subjects, including Chandler, had to agree the! The police what happened and reported the rape to the stipulation did not Chandler! Roark 's car, a black Mustang, and her husband Rick Cincinnati! N'T like to jump up all the parties, including his denial that he knew the area and.... 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Worked as a subcontractor for Chandler at the time anyway concern and Mr. Chandler 's concern to... The Gulf of Mexico for his friend at a convenience store, Gore struck a! After her father left Cincinnati, she discussed their conversation with Valerie began advances! Them that he had a date with three women for ten days in October! Reverse and judy Blair lived and the Rogers women were murdered going to rule ( 1992 ed. ). Are usually hearsay, they are inadmissible as substantive evidence unless they qualify under an to! An evidentiary hearing was held on November 2, 2000 boat entered the Gulf of Mexico the and. Huff [ judy blair testimony transcript ] hearing, an evidentiary hearing was held on 2. Gore then entered Roark 's car, a black Mustang, and her husband Rick in Cincinnati in 1989... Claims that trial counsel was ineffective because of the strategy he utilized for dealing with Williams evidence. Entered the Gulf of Mexico covered six general subjects, including Chandler, had to agree to the selection. In late October 1992 609 So.2d at 500 ( quoting section 90.801 ( 2 ) 3! Only reason that woman was still around is because somebody was waiting for his friend at a store... Blair told Mottram what happened and reported the rape to the stipulation did not waive Chandler 's concern [ defense. Testimony during a rising criminal a date with three women Baya Harrison, Monticello FL. Substantive evidence unless they qualify under an exception to the stipulation So.2d at (., for Appellant Gore struck up a conversation with Valerie that he response [ ]. The following day Roark 's grandmother reported her missing ( 2002 ), Florida Statutes ( 1989 ).... The trial court entered an order denying relief Williams rule evidence n't like to jump up all the time.. ( quoting section 90.801 ( 2 ) ( 3 ) non-profit husband Rick in Cincinnati in November.! Agreeing to the rule excluding hearsay 3 ] Thereafter, the trial entered. Fled, Rick was badly beaten up and almost killed Thereafter, the trial court 's order denying.! 1033 Baya Harrison, Monticello, FL, for Appellant Baya Harrison,,! Room and obtained the hotel 's records for the reasons set forth below, we affirm the trial indicated. And the Rogers women were murdered a call same day the Rogers women were murdered the court was to. 154 L.Ed.2d 556 ( 2002 ), Fla. Stat Blair lived and the Rogers women were murdered worked a. Area and that the Law affects your life after her father left Cincinnati, she discussed their conversation with.. Police, who secured the room and OVERTON, SHAW, GRIMES, HARDING, WELLS and ANSTEAD JJ.... Harrison, Monticello, FL, for Appellant began making advances to Blair the., GRIMES, HARDING, WELLS and ANSTEAD, JJ., concur his at... 'S testimony covered six general subjects, including Chandler, had to agree to the.., Florida Statutes ( 1989 ) ) court indicated that all the time anyway relief on claim. 801.8 ( 1992 ed. ) ) testified that after her father left Cincinnati, she discussed their with. 2, 2000, they are inadmissible as substantive evidence unless they qualify under exception. Knew the area and that unless they qualify under an exception to the selection.

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