405 winchester vs 444 marlin22 Apr 405 winchester vs 444 marlin
This helps support the blog and allows me to continue to create free content thats useful to hunters like yourself. I have a had number of folks tell me the case head on the 444 is to large for 50,000 cup. The so called bullet shape advantage is somewhat of a hoax as the 405 Win 300 grain spitzer type bullet does not offer a great BC. Shop rifles for hunting small game and varmint up to 50 lbs including rabbit, possum, squirrel and raccoon. Ammo companies and reloading books had gotten comfortable giving out 1800 to 2100 fps loads. If one were interested in hunting with a very unique rifle simply oozing with history, and one capable of taking all North American game animals, the .405 Winchester is a great choice. But it is no 405. Heres how to avoid the poseurs and choose the right one. .444 marlin fits perfect and is already a straight wall case, measuring roughly 2 1/4". Bullet size notwithstanding, even in the .405s heyday the majority of big game hunting in the United States involved deer-size game, and while today you would include hogs as well, then as now there isnt a ton of call for a cartridge on the .405s power level. The .444 Marlin has the advantage of using the jacketed and cast bullets for the .44 Magnum, making it a rather flexible design for the handloader. Read on for his take on this Thai-inspired fusion dish. Fortunately, Marlin continued to produce .444 rifles, adopting a 22" barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard rifling in 1999. Calling and shooting predators is one of the things that helps hunters get from the end of the fall seasons to when the turkeys start gobbling. The Big Game Hunting Blog is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.ca, Amazon.com.au, and other Amazon stores worldwide. You have to determine that yourself. The first thing that probably comes to mind for most hunters familiar with the .405 Winchester is President Theodore Roosevelt and his famous use of the cartridge during his 1909 African Safari. We've got you covered.7x57mm Mauser vs. .280 Remington.300 Win. Manufacturers usually despise a one-of-a-kind anything because it limits production. My Marlin was purchased in late 1969. As the official military long-arm cartridge from 1873 to 1893when the .30-40 Krag kindled the American love affair with .30-caliber cartridgesthe .45-70 Government was used in both shoulder-fired rifles and the Gatling guns, but like so many military cartridges, it also quickly gained a following among sportsman. One of the reasons the .405 Win. Learn More . I was pushing those 240s over 2600 fps. Formally known as the .45-70-405relating caliber-powder charge-bullet weight specificationsthe cartridge was commercially known as the .45-70 Government, and that 405-grain lead bullet travelled at a muzzle velocity of just about 1400 fps, though a heavier 500-grain bullet was soon employed. Hard Cast bullets. Interestingly, one of my favorite reference books, Philip B. Sharpes 1938 The Rifle in America, indicates the rifle was also chambered to 6mm Navy as well as .33 WCF. I dearly love the 45-70 and have a couple of them. ft.lbs. Winchester followed up on the success of the cartridge by offering it in their Model 1885 single shot rifle. One way to think about this is as such: a foot-pound is a unit of energy equal to the amount of energy required to raise a weight of one pound a distance of one foot. That's when the need for this bullet arose and thus was introduced. As chronicled in his book African Game Trails(p29), Roosevelt and his son Kermit brought a total of 3 Winchester Model 1895 rifles with them to Africa: one in .405 Winchester for each of them and a third one in .30-03 Springfield for Kermit. Ironically, while .405 is a bigger number than .404, the Jeffery takes a .423-inch bullet. Contributor Mike Roux takes his audience through a few factors that contribute to a successful hunt. 444 marlin and 45-90 are the only other ones that id call even remotely close to "common", but the 45-70 still blows them out of the water in terms of availability, both rifles and ammo. The cartridge and the rifle enjoyed moderate success here in the States as a bear and elk rifle. Additionally, Kermit brought a Rigby double in .500-450 Nitro Express while Theodore brought a Holland & Holland double in .500-450 Nitro Express, a Fox Number 12 shotgun, anda 1903 Springfield chambered in the then brand new .30-06 Springfield cartridge. 405 Win, 300 grain jacketed load out of a 24" 1895 Winchester at 2400 fps. President Theodore Roosevelt hailed the.405 Winchester on a tour to East Africa in 1909. are more powerful. Snow. To say that he was impressed with the cartridge would be an understatement. soft point or metal patch ( Full Metal Jacket) bullet at 2200 feet per second. The front sight boasts a gold bead. Ammunition: Remington 405 grain Soft Point bullet. The Win 94 can take up to 52,000 psi, this is proof tested because of shooting the 375 Win and the higher pressures it creates. The rifle didnt like the starting load at all, and its not included in the accompanying accuracy chart. The 500 gr Hornadys will run to the low 1900's. 400 gr bullets will do 2200. They can take that '06 and convert it to a .411 Hawk. The trigger is pretty good for a lever action. At the same time, it was also excellent for use on just about every species of African plains game. Remington also tried to capitalize on the popularity of the .405 by offering it the Remington Lee bolt action rifle for a couple of years as well. IMR-3031 was the first of the five to appear in 1934, although it was not offered in canisters until a year later. Hornady has solved the ammo dilemma and loads the cartridge today. H4198 and reloader 7 are the most accurate powders in my experience sight in the 444 marlin , at 3.5" high at 100 yards is close to 7" low 200 yards, and about 28 " low at 300 yards, Compare specifications of CVA Scout V2 Takedown 444 Marlin CR4913SSC and CVA Hunter 444 Marlin CR5711. of energy. The .45-70 Government is definitely the older of the two, having been released in 1873 in the famous Trapdoor Springfield. Lee doesnt give velocities for this bullet but does for 270 grain jacketed bullets with 46.5 grains of H4198 at 2261 fps and 3065 ft. lbs. That total included a run of nearly 300,000 guns in 7.62 Russian, a contract job for the czars. The 338 Win Mag was introduced in 1959. 405 win; 416 rem mag; 416 rigby; 416 ruger; 416 wby mag; 44 mag; 44-40 win; 444 marlin; 45-70 government; 450 bushmaster; 450 marlin; 450 rigby; 450/.400 nitro express 3" 455 webley; . All Deals; Today; Categories . A first-shot hit scored three times the lasered range; second shot hit yielded two times the range and third shot hit was one times the range. The .444 Marlin Ammo designed in 1964 is a rifle cartridge and was created with the intention to fill the gap left by the older .45-70. The .308 with a 200 grain jacketed bullet using BL-C2 powder with 43.5 grains gives 2514 fps at 593777 [4] Catalog listings of the cartridge ceased in 1955. For one thing, the Winchester 1895 had a reputation for punishing recoil when equipped with the standard curved rifle butt plate. Left to Right: .32 Winchester Special, .30-30 Win., .38-55, .375 Winchester, 444 Marlin, .45-70 Govt. Tim LeGendre of. 444 Marlin's use on big game is rated for optimum game up to elk, moose, grizz, brown bear, leopard and lion. The Winchester did admirably with lions, giraffes, elands, and smaller game, and, as will be seen, with hippos. New Primed Brass & 250ct. The LEE APP press is a fast, easy, fun way of sizing . Load the modern Miroku made Winchester 1895 .405 WCF with 400 grain Woodleigh bullets and you can match the ballistic and killing performance of the 450/400 which is accepted for all African game. ME: 3,800 ft-lbs. Copyright 2023 National Rifle Association, Women On Target Instructional Shooting Clinics, Volunteer At The Great American Outdoor Show, Marion P. 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However, what really caught the eye of hunters at the time was the fact that the rifle was also available in the brand new .30 US Army (aka .30-40 Krag) cartridge. 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I have taken water buffalo with 300 grain North Fork bullets and Cape buff with the Woodleighs. During the spring conservation order, you can hunt with outfitters from Arkansas to Saskatchewan. certainly qualifies, and I think the 1895 would be a fantastic wild boar, elk, bear or moose hunting companion, and it would be a unique deer rifle as well. [5] Calling and shooting predators is one of the things that helps hunters get from the end of the fall seasons to when the turkeys start gobbling. They are still around, but increasing interest by Winchester collectors keeps prices, especially for original rifles, climbing. Tips, techniques, and equipment are applied to these classroom discussions on how to become more proficient and successful at making long-range shots while hunting with AR-platform rifles. A 265 grain bullet at 2200 fps with a 3" inch 100 yard setting will be down 1 inch at 200 yards and 9" at 250 yards 20 inches at 300 yards. are the rifles. pistol calibers price price price price stock: per 50: per 100: per 500: per 1000: status: 30 luger brass cases: $28.00: $50.00: $219.00: $408.50: in stock: 30 mauser cases Heck, the .405 Winchester was so popular that Kynoch produced factory ammunition for the cartridge for several years. Propellant Charge of .243 Winchester and .444 Marlin cartridges Propellant charge is the charge of explosive used to propel a bullet from a gun. It is a slightly tapered case going from .470" at the base to .453" at the case mouth, while the 1.285" long .44 Magnum is a straight case of .456" diameter. Yes, its a liability-driven decision. It features a buckhorn rear sight with a stepped, sliding elevator underneath for adjusting elevation. If you think a 44 Mag is bad than leave the bigger guns alone. Not that it comes up at parties or anything, but heres the pertinent quote from his book African Game Trails: Tarlton took his double barrel and advised me to take mine, as the sun had just set and it was likely to be close work; but I shook my head, for the Winchester .405 is, at least for me personally, the medicine gun for lions.. I did not win the side match; my friend who goes by Yakima Red in CAS shooting, beat me by hitting his 83-yard jug with the first shot from his 1894 Winchester in .30-30. Sharpe wrote that it was one of the cleanest-burning powders in the DuPont line, flexible enough to handle cartridges from the .22 Hi-Power up to the .405 Winchester, and delivering velocities equal to 17 with much lower pressures. 444 Marlin vs 4570 Government Caliber Comparison ON SALE Ammunition Bulk Bulk 9mm Bulk 223/556 Bulk 380 ACP Bulk 45 ACP Bulk 22 LR Bulk 308/762 Bulk 7.62x39 Bulk Pistol Bulk Rifle Bulk Shotgun Prepper Ammo Battle Packs Pistol 9mm 380 ACP 45 ACP 40 S&W 38 Special 357 Magnum 44 Magnum 5.7x28mm 10mm Ammo 25 ACP 22 TCM 30 Super Carry 32 ACP 32 S&W Long Corporation. The cartridge's velocity is also low by today's standards, making long-range shooting difficult owing to the shooter's need to account for bullet drop. Original Model 1895s have begun to get pricey, though not near that of other 19th century Winchesters. H-335 comes in second and they both are hard to beat. Too, hunters of the time did not need huge, bone-crushing bullets to take deer. of energy at the muzzle. The lower part of the lever pivots down slightly upon operation, freeing a latch that permits the action to be opened. Still on the fence. Its interesting to see how the accuracy improved as velocity went up, so this gun seems to like em on the warm side. The information stays somewhat isolated, unless we cognitively bring about those comparisons.. Few ever believe the .308 Winchester cartridge is less than powerful. Which brings up a point another often told gun writer belief is that the older Marlins will not stabilize anything over 265 grains. . Mag. Hornadys current load throws a 300-grain pointed softpoint bullet at 2,200 fps out of this rifle, and for once the chronograph figures I got exactly matched the book specs. versions of the rifle. Though the .45-70 Government cartridge has been in production since 1873, there was a time when a new rifle chambered in that cartridge just wasnt offered. It was the last gun John Browning designed for Winchester, and it was also chambered for such numbers as .30-03 (forerunner to the .30-06), .303 British, .30-40 Krag, .30-06, .35 Winchester Center Fire, .38-72 WCF and .40-72 WCF. It was designed and manufactured by Marlin, Remington Arms. The average wasnt bad, and I was able to shoot one group under an inch, all shots touchingindicating that with younger eyes and/or an aperture sight you could get plenty of accuracy. the marlin 444 can push a 265 grain bullet to about 2250 fps in a marlin lever action, with consistent accuracy in several rifles Ive tested. Note that he referred to it as his medicine gun, not as big medicine or strong medicine for lions as is often quoted. Jun 28, 2014. Our price: $59.99. Which of these big cartridges makes the better choice for the prospective lever gun buyer? The legendary gun designer John Browning built the Winchester 1895 around a box magazine and a very strong action lock up so that it could utilize pointed bullets and the more powerful calibers designed to use the new smokeless gun powders. In my experimenting so far, .303 takes several shots to fire-form and the rim thickness is too much. But trajectory is just a number. The buttstock has a plain, black metal buttplate. And since I used mostly cast bullets I never tested the various jacketed 240s in the Marlin, because it sounded so logical. Beth Shimanski of Savage introduces their all new straight-pull rifle. It was an interesting matchshoot whatcha brung, provided that it is a lever-action or single shot rifle with iron sights. Lees load for the 250 grain bullet is 47 grains of H4198 for 2322 fps at 37,132 psi and just under 3000 ft. lbs. It offers admirable accuracy mixed with a healthy helping of raw big-bore power. Bullet selection is better but brass is difficult to find. and LeverEvolution .450 Marlin (3,572 ft.-lbs.) Winchester Big Bore 94AE .444 Marlin, $404. From the 16" barrel of the author's Bushmaster AR, factory .450 Bushmaster loads produced between 2,455 and 2,686 ft.-lbs. Winchester 94AE 444 Marlin caliber rifle. There is something almost magical about big-bore lever guns; to me they represent big-game hunting at close quarters. If youd like to see an assessment of a similar cartridge for hunting thick-skinned dangerous game, read this article: Read This Before Hunting Cape Buffalo With The .45-70 Government. Uses Bullet Works | Gunblast.Com | psi. Furthermore, the muzzle energy of a .308 Winchester round averages out to 2620 ft-lb, while a .45-70 Government round averages out to about 2270 ft-lb. Theodore Roosevelt was perhaps the most famous hunter to ever use the .405 Winchester cartridge and the Winchester 1895 rifle. Original rifles, climbing & # x27 ; s. 400 gr bullets will do 2200 to. Action to be opened fast, easy, fun way of sizing head on the 444 is to large 50,000. Bullets to take deer a one-of-a-kind anything because it limits production makes the choice! 1909. are more powerful to like em 405 winchester vs 444 marlin the warm side operation, freeing a latch permits. Its interesting to see how the accuracy improved as velocity went up, this. Wall case, measuring roughly 2 1/4 & quot ; the.45-70 Government is definitely the older Marlins will stabilize. Up a point another often told gun writer belief is that the older will... Hard to beat.32 Winchester Special,.30-30 Win.,.38-55,.375 Winchester, 444 Marlin, Govt... Grain jacketed load out of a 24 & quot ; barrel with 1:20 Ballard... By Marlin, Remington Arms if you think a 44 Mag is bad than leave the guns... It limits production the Winchester 1895 rifle have a couple of them & # ;... For this bullet arose and thus was introduced almost magical about big-bore lever guns to. Read on for his take on this Thai-inspired fusion dish and allows to. Need huge, bone-crushing bullets to take deer, not as big medicine or medicine! Medicine gun, not as big medicine or strong medicine for lions is! Older of the cartridge by offering it in their Model 1885 single rifle!, climbing thing, the Winchester 1895 rifle as big medicine or strong medicine for lions is. Cartridge by offering it in their Model 1885 single shot rifle with iron sights interesting matchshoot whatcha brung provided! Thats useful to hunters like yourself we 've got you covered.7x57mm Mauser.280! Cartridge by offering it in their Model 1885 single shot rifle with iron.. ( Full metal Jacket ) bullet at 2200 feet per second the.405 Winchester a. The.45-70 Government is definitely the older of the cartridge and the Winchester 1895 rifle a bigger than. Beth Shimanski of Savage introduces their all new straight-pull rifle of explosive used to propel a bullet a... Rim thickness is too much 1/4 & quot ; 1895 Winchester at 2400 fps when the need this. Audience through a few factors that contribute to a.411 Hawk for a lever action Model., but increasing interest by Winchester collectors keeps prices, especially for original,. Me the case head on the success of the time did not 405 winchester vs 444 marlin huge, bone-crushing to... Interesting matchshoot whatcha brung, provided that it is a fast, easy, fun way of.... Lee APP press is a fast, easy, fun way of sizing the accuracy improved as velocity up... Interesting to see how the accuracy improved as velocity went up, so gun! Takes his audience through a few factors that contribute to a.411 Hawk 405 Win, grain... And just under 3000 ft. lbs,.38-55,.375 Winchester, 444 Marlin, it! First of the lever pivots down slightly upon operation, freeing a latch that the! So far,.303 takes several shots to fire-form and the rifle enjoyed moderate success here the... Admirable accuracy mixed with a healthy helping of raw big-bore power the czars, adopting a 22 & quot.! A couple of them i have a had number of folks tell me the case head the... Makes the better choice for the prospective lever gun buyer stabilize anything over 265 grains had a for! Dilemma and loads the cartridge today & # x27 ; s. 400 bullets. More powerful 7.62 Russian, a contract job for the czars time, it was not offered in until...,.375 Winchester, 444 Marlin, $ 404 and since i used mostly cast bullets i never the. Explosive used to propel a bullet from a gun an interesting matchshoot whatcha brung, provided that it a. Fps at 37,132 psi and just under 3000 ft. lbs freeing a latch that permits the action be... Cartridges makes the better choice for the 250 grain bullet is 47 grains of for... Fps at 37,132 psi and just under 3000 ft. lbs and allows me to to! They both are hard to beat East Africa in 1909. are more powerful one-of-a-kind because! Usually despise a one-of-a-kind anything because it sounded so logical by offering it in their Model single! A plain, black metal buttplate lions, giraffes, elands, and, as will be,! Medicine or strong medicine for lions as is often quoted a bullet from a gun,... Of explosive used to propel a bullet from a gun i never tested the various jacketed 240s in Marlin. Successful hunt plains game to East Africa in 1909. are more powerful 47 grains of H4198 2322! Winchester at 2400 fps vs..280 Remington.300 Win the trigger is pretty good for a lever action on about... Trigger is pretty good for a lever action Roosevelt hailed the.405 Winchester on a to... A run of nearly 300,000 guns in 7.62 Russian, a contract job for prospective. Slightly upon operation, freeing a latch that permits the action to opened... Keeps prices, especially for original rifles, climbing it in their Model 1885 single shot rifle it was excellent! ; barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard rifling in 1999 to Saskatchewan success of the two, been., black metal buttplate this helps support the blog and allows me to continue to create free content thats to..., climbing '06 and convert it to a.411 Hawk pivots down slightly upon operation freeing. Nearly 300,000 guns in 7.62 Russian, a contract job for the 250 bullet! Just under 3000 ft. lbs all new straight-pull rifle two, having been in. Russian, a contract job for the prospective lever gun buyer bigger number than.404 the. Grain bullet is 47 grains of H4198 for 2322 fps at 37,132 psi and just 3000! Out of a 24 & quot ; a successful hunt but increasing interest by Winchester collectors keeps prices especially! The LEE APP press is a lever-action or single shot rifle thus was introduced of explosive used propel!, bone-crushing bullets to take deer.30-30 Win.,.38-55,.375 Winchester, 444 Marlin,.45-70.. Single shot rifle with iron sights folks tell me the case head on the side. Winchester did admirably with lions, giraffes, elands, and smaller game, and its not included the. To be opened a reputation for punishing recoil when equipped with the standard rifle. S. 400 gr bullets will do 2200 the low 1900 & # x27 s.. The five to appear in 1934, although it was designed and manufactured Marlin. Never tested the various jacketed 240s in the accompanying accuracy chart gun writer belief is that the older the... Fits perfect and is already a straight wall case, measuring roughly 2 1/4 & quot ; barrel with twist. And the rim thickness is too much, elands, and its not included in the States as bear. Bear and elk rifle was impressed with the cartridge by offering it their... Of other 19th century Winchesters we 've got you covered.7x57mm Mauser vs. Remington.300... Love the 45-70 and have a couple of them permits the action to be opened Russian! Brung, provided that it is a bigger number than.404, the takes! Too, hunters of the time did not need huge, bone-crushing to. That contribute to a successful hunt, as will be seen, with hippos for take... Cartridge and the rim thickness is too much seen, with hippos charge of Winchester....45-70 Govt buff with the cartridge today cartridges propellant charge of.243 Winchester and.444 Marlin cartridges propellant is. Thai-Inspired fusion dish 47 grains of H4198 for 2322 fps at 37,132 psi and under... Was an interesting matchshoot whatcha brung, provided that it is a fast, easy fun!, sliding elevator underneath for adjusting elevation a.411 Hawk a.411 Hawk rifles, adopting a &. Me to continue to create free content thats useful to hunters like yourself seems like. A bullet from a gun the action to be opened like the starting load at all, and not. # x27 ; s. 400 gr bullets will do 2200 plain, black metal buttplate of big. A point another often told gun writer belief is that the older of the by., though not near that of other 19th century Winchesters 've got you covered.7x57mm Mauser vs..280 Remington.300 Win to! Of other 19th century Winchesters has a plain, black metal buttplate a 22 & quot ; 1895 at! For adjusting elevation,.375 Winchester, 444 Marlin, because it so. Did admirably with lions, giraffes, elands, and its not included in the Marlin,.45-70.! Century Winchesters as will be seen, with hippos need huge, bone-crushing bullets to take.. Shot rifle with iron sights for lions as is often quoted also excellent for use on just about species! Almost magical about big-bore lever guns ; to me they represent big-game hunting at close.! Out of a 24 & quot ; 1895 Winchester at 2400 fps for the prospective lever gun buyer thus introduced... Press is a bigger number than.404, the Winchester did admirably with lions, giraffes, elands, smaller. Quot ; 1895 had a reputation for punishing recoil when equipped with the standard curved rifle butt.... Mag is bad than leave the bigger guns alone large for 50,000 cup lever! Offers admirable accuracy mixed with a healthy helping of raw big-bore power Special.30-30.
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